Lord Percy / Prof Fuller: Spot the Difference

The Black Adder: The Queen of Spain’s Beard

Percy: My Lord…
Edmund: Yes, what is it?
Percy: You know, they do say that the Infanta’s eyes are more beau­ti­ful than the fam­ous Stone of Galve­ston.
Edmund: Mm! … What?
Percy: The fam­ous Stone of Galve­ston, My Lord.
Edmund: And what’s that, exactly?
Percy: Well, it’s a fam­ous blue stone, and it comes (points dra­mat­ic­ally) from Galve­ston.
Edmund: I see. And what about it?
Percy: Well, My Lord, the Infanta’s eyes are bluer than it, for a start.
Edmund: I see. And have you ever seen this stone?
Percy: (nods) No, not as such, My Lord, but I know a couple of people who have, and they say it’s very very blue indeed.
Edmund: And have these people seen the Infanta’s eyes?
Percy: No, I shouldn’t think so, My Lord.
Edmund: And neither have you, pre­sum­ably.
Percy: No, My Lord.
Edmund: So, what you’re telling me, Percy, is that some­thing you have never seen is slightly less blue than some­thing else you have never seen.
Percy: (finally begins to grasp) Yes, My Lord.

And from the cur­rent Times Higher Edu­ca­tion Sup­ple­ment:

…New­ton presen­ted his math­em­at­ical phys­ics as the divine plan that was impli­citly writ­ten into the Bible. He clearly thought he had got into God’s mind. In con­trast, Dar­win pur­sued the hum­bler path of Wil­liam Paley’s ana­logy of nature’s order being like a watch found on a beach, which implied the exist­ence of a watch­maker. Unfor­tu­nately, the fossil record revealed to Dar­win only a lot of broken half-watches, noth­ing that could have been pro­duced by a God worthy of human respect. Darwin’s humil­ity remained, but his faith disappeared.

In today’s sec­u­lar cul­ture, Dar­win is more read­ily embraced than New­ton as a sci­entific icon although New­ton remains unques­tion­ably the greater sci­ent­ist. The Amer­ican Museum of Nat­ural His­tory has an exhibit devoted to Darwin’s life that includes a recon­struc­tion of his home. This is not sur­pris­ing. Darwin’s bio­graphy pro­jects the polit­ic­ally cor­rect image of a Chris­tian who loses his faith through sci­entific inquiry. We are unlikely to see a sim­ilar exhibit for New­ton because his life teaches that the Bible can provide a sure path to great science.

I don’t recall Darwin’s the­ory being strongly built on fossil evid­ence. In fact it has a chapter where he talks about the paucity of fossil evid­ence. Equally I don’t recall the Bible being a primer on basic math­em­at­ics, so I’m not con­vinced that Newton’s tale would be one of the Bible being a sure path to great sci­ence. At the end of his life New­ton either turned from the Bible to fail at alchemy, or else the Bible’s chapters on alchemy are in error, or as a third option, Fuller is in error and the Bible is irrel­ev­ant to Newton’s sci­entific success.

Fuller goes on:

Con­trary to pop­u­lar accounts, Dar­win never provided a mech­an­istic account of evol­u­tion because he lacked a cred­ible the­ory of genet­ics. Indeed, by the time The Ori­gin of Spe­cies reached its 50th birth­day in 1909, Darwin’s the­ory was itself close to extinc­tion. It could offer only “just so”

The pop­u­lar accounts that I’ve read say that Dar­win failed to provide a mech­an­istic account of evol­u­tion, and instead tried to argue for blend­ing of attrib­utes. I’m not aware of any evid­ence that Darwin’s the­ory of Des­cent with Nat­ural Selec­tion was on its way out before the Mod­ern Syn­thesis with Mendel’s Genet­ics. Can any­one sug­gest some help­ful read­ing to plug that gap?* Mendel’s work was re-discovered in 1900 (Steve Jones Almost Like a Whale 1999 p144). While the import­ance to evol­u­tion was recog­nised there wasn’t agree­ment on exactly how that mech­an­ism worked. The dis­cus­sion was rather vig­or­ous and, I think the first paper to fully syn­thes­ise the two didn’t appear till 1918 but there were argu­ments aplenty before them. Indeed, argu­ments on the details of mech­an­ism con­tinue to this day, so I’m not quite sure how “close to extinc­tion” is an accur­ate descrip­tion. I would have thought a the­ory close to being dis­carded would have been ignored rather than debated.

I have to admit Fuller’s argu­ments are pretty con­vin­cing so long as you don’t actu­ally exam­ine the evid­ence. As a res­ult I’m not that bothered about his opin­ion per se. What is inter­est­ing is the ques­tion “How does this stuff get published?”

Incor­rect ideas are pub­lished all the time. The really inter­est­ing ones are the ones that people are still arguing are wrong dec­ades later. If you’re writ­ing on pre­his­toric Europe then Gor­don Childe, who I think has been argued by vari­ous people to be wrong on almost every spe­cific detail, is a good place to start. He may be wrong, but he’s inter­est­ing, intel­li­gent and a thought-provoking depar­ture point to dis­cuss what may have happened in pre­his­toric Europe. If you want to argue that Childe was wrong about some­thing you have to do quite a bit of work to show it. Fuller’s argu­ments on the other hand, when he presents them in clear lan­guage seem to be plainly erro­neous, irrel­ev­ant or both. And these are not dif­fi­cult things to show. If it’s not depth of thought, intel­li­gib­ilty or inter­est­ing­ness that’s the reason for suc­cess in soci­ology then what is?

Speak­ing as a non-sociologist*, it would appear there’s no qual­ity con­trol in soci­olo­gical peer-review. That doesn’t mean that all soci­ology is rub­bish. On the con­trary there’s some inter­est­ing mater­ial. Rather it means that if you want to know what the good mater­ial is, the last per­son you should ask is a soci­olo­gist. It would also sug­gest that if everything does go wrong I can move to War­wick and become a sage of sci­ence without hav­ing to do dif­fi­cult stuff. Instead I can argue that someone’s work that haven’t really read is less sci­entific that someone else’s work that I haven’t read.

…and finally. The intro­duc­tion says:

Steve Fuller argues that intel­li­gent design shows how the Bible has been a power­ful spur to science…

Well, I sup­pose he does, but he doesn’t provide any evid­ence that intel­li­gent design is the least bit sci­entific. He does seem a little intent on trash­ing his own repu­ta­tion.

* Update: Jonathan Badger and Bob O’H cor­rect me on the eclipse of Dar­win­ism in com­ments 3 and 5. Bur­idan under­stand­ably skew­ers the para­graph “Speak­ing as a non-sociologist…” in com­ment 7. I could pre­tend that the first half of that para­graph was satir­ical, but the real­ity is that it was typ­ing without enga­ging the brain. As the say­ing goes: “When arguing with a stu­pid per­son, make sure they’re not doing the same.”

3 Comments

  1. Pharyngula

    Lord Percy / Prof Fuller: Spot the Difference

    Fuller and the fam­ous Stone of Galveston

    I think Steve Fuller has had more than enough atten­tion paid to him lately, don't you? There's a new line­backer pil­ing on, though, and I thought this art­icle was such a nice, lucid skew­er­ing that I had to bring it to everyone's attention…

    Reply

  2. The Panda’s Thumb

    Lord Percy / Prof Fuller: Spot the Difference

    Fuller and the fam­ous Stone of Galveston

    I think Steve Fuller has had more than enough atten­tion paid to him lately, don’t you? There’s a new line­backer pil­ing on, though, and I thought this art­icle was such a nice, lucid skew­er­ing that I had to bring…

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Jonathan Badger
    “I’m not aware of any evid­ence that Darwin’s the­ory of Des­cent with Nat­ural Selec­tion was on its way out before the Mod­ern Syn­thesis with Mendel’s Genet­ics. Can any­one sug­gest some help­ful read­ing to plug that gap?”

    Yes. Read Bowler’s “Evol­u­tion: The His­tory of an Idea”. It’s pretty com­mon for his­tor­i­ans of sci­ence to speak of the “Eclipse of Dar­win­ism” from 1900 to about 1930. It’s hard for us to under­stand today, but early genet­i­cists like Bateson and Mor­gan really thought that Mendelian genet­ics inval­id­ated nat­ural selec­tion. Of course these sci­ent­ists weren’t cre­ation­ists, and still respec­ted Dar­win as a pop­ular­izer of the idea of evol­u­tion, but felt that selec­tion had only a minor role.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Bald­rick
    Just wait. I’ll bet all of these IDi­ots have a cun­ning plan that they’re just wait­ing to spring on us.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Bob O’H
    “I’m not aware of any evid­ence that Darwin’s the­ory of Des­cent with Nat­ural Selec­tion was on its way out before the Mod­ern Syn­thesis with Mendel’s Genet­ics. Can any­one sug­gest some help­ful read­ing to plug that gap?”

    Bowler’s his­tory of evol­u­tion­ary the­ory, “Evol­u­tion: The His­tory of an Idea” dis­cusses this in a chapter called “The eclipse of Dar­win­ism” (Ch. 9 in my 1989 edi­tion, seems to be Ch. 7 in a newer version).

    Bob

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: An Enquir­ing Mind
    I loves bible math! Here’s my favor­ite bit o’ bible math: Accordin’ to the “Intel­li­gent Designer’s” infal­lible good book pi = 3. Can you ima­gine what the Uni­verse would look like if’un the “Intel­li­gent Designer” had used pi = 3 in cob­blin’ together “His” cre­ation? I used to know the pas­sage by heart, but it’s been a while since I used it to con­found my fundy acquaint­ances. It’s some­where in the OT.

    Speakin’ of Sir Isaac, didn’t he spend more time and write a big­ger tome than the Prin­cipia tryin’ to prove the Pope was the Anti-christ?

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Bur­idan
    “Speak­ing as a non-sociologist, it would appear there’s no qual­ity con­trol in soci­olo­gical peer-review.”

    I would never defend Fuller’s sil­li­ness regard­ing intel­li­gent design. How­ever, your above quote (among a few oth­ers) is a little on the out­rageous side and actu­ally does what you and oth­ers are accus­ing Fuller of doing.

    As a “non-sociologist,” how many peer-reviewed art­icles have you read in soci­olo­gical journ­als? Or bet­ter yet, can you name a single soci­olo­gical journal off the top of your head? What’s your evid­ence for the claim that soci­olo­gical peer review appears to have no qual­ity con­trol? As your post sug­gests, you have a sample of 1 (Steven Fuller) on which you draw your sweep­ing con­clu­sions about an entire dis­cip­line. Are you try­ing to make a ser­i­ous argu­ment here or just spout­ing off from the hip?

    Most people who take the sci­entific method ser­i­ously would find it enough to simply com­ment on Fuller’s folly and not make the meth­od­o­lo­gic­ally embar­rass­ing move of arguing from an n of 1. Your malign­ing of a whole dis­cip­line on the work of a single scholar betrays your own appar­ent sci­entific sensibilities.

    There’s plenty of evid­ence on which to cri­ti­cize the soci­olo­gical ima­gin­a­tion in its present form. As a soci­olo­gist, I’ve done my fair share of cri­ti­ciz­ing soci­olo­gical fluff but I do my home­work first and never implic­ate an entire dis­cip­line for the fool­ish­ness of a few – in your case the fool­ish­ness of one.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: alun
    My thanks to Jonathan and Bob for point­ing out a hole in my read­ing which I’ll have to plug in the New Year.

    I also think that Bur­idan is being gen­er­ous to me when he says, “your above quote (among a few oth­ers) is a little on the out­rageous side”. I could point out that I’ve tried to tackle Latour’s work here too, but that still not enough to lift the com­ment from fool­ish­ness. To make mat­ters worse I prin­ted out “Women’s Rights and Women’s Rites: Reli­gion at the His­tor­ical Root of Gender Strat­i­fic­a­tion” by Mar­garet Gon­soulin yes­ter­day from EJS. One of the dif­fer­ences is that Gonsoulin’s work was peer-reviewed and Fuller’s opin­ion in THES prob­ably wasn’t. I think that moves me from “a little on the out­rag­ous side” and towards “bloody stupid”.

    I’m for­tu­nate that people are will­ing to com­ment when I’m being Per­cy­ish myself.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Bur­idan
    You’ve done your­self well alun. I hon­estly don’t think your com­ments were “bloody stu­pid.” In any event, it’s rare to see the type of response you’ve just given and you’ve caught me off guard — a bit­ter les­son in my own cyn­icism. Thank you for demon­strat­ing reas­on­able­ness. I too often for­get that myself and will take your example as a reminder.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Lee J Rick­ard
    I think that Michael Ruse does a pretty good job of describ­ing the com­plex his­tory of evol­u­tion­ary the­ory between Dar­win and the neo-Darwinian syn­thesis. You might want to read that too.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Tim Makin­son
    It’s inter­est­ing that New­ton is increas­ingly being presen­ted as an icon of the­istic sci­ence these days. I was already aware of his con­nec­tion to alchemy and astro­logy (giv­ing him a more satanic than saintly appear­ance to ortho­dox theo­logy). Can any­body point to sources that illu­min­ate exactly what influ­ence Chris­tian­ity had on his science?

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: djmul­len
    New­ton was def­in­itely a believer, but he had some reser­va­tions about the Bible. One pamph­let he wrote, but was afraid to pub­lish, was entitled, “A His­tor­ical Account of Two Not­able Cor­rup­tions of Scrip­ture.” Details at http://www.cyberistan.org/islamic/newton1.html

    New­ton left a trunk full of mys­tical and alchem­ical pub­lic­a­tions that was even­tu­ally pur­chased by the great eco­nom­ist, John Maynard Keynes. Details at http://pr.caltech.edu/periodicals/CaltechNews/articles/v39/newtonian.html

    If I remem­ber rightly, he had to take a false oath to be a uni­ver­sity pro­fessor because he didn’t com­pletely agree with the dogma of the Anglican church.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Keith Douglas
    New­ton was a the­ist, to be sure, and would prob­ably have regarded him­self as ortho­dox, when in fact he was quite clearly heretical, being an arian.

    Fuller, as usual for most soci­olo­gists of sci­ence, unfor­tu­nately, does not seem to want to draw the dis­tinc­tion between the motiv­a­tions of sci­ent­ists and the con­tent of sci­entific research and findings.

    COMMENT:
    AUTHOR: Pierce R. But­ler
    New­ton was born into a fam­ily of Pur­it­ans and remained one all his life — a dif­fi­cult soci­opol­it­ical pos­i­tion in Eng­land after the death of Crom­well and wide­spread, well-justified resent­ment at everything the Pur­itan “round­heads” had done after win­ning the Eng­lish Civil War. His biblical-“mathematical” works, many of which were not burnt, were hardly equi­val­ent to, say, his inven­tion of the cal­cu­lus; for example, he pre­dicted (in private papers) that Jews would reclaim Jer­u­s­alem in 1899 and Christ would return in 1948. An excel­lent source on his alchem­ical life is Michael White’s _Isaac New­ton: The Last Sorceror_.

    Reply

  3. Pharyngula

    Lord Percy / Prof Fuller: Spot the Difference

    Eight good essays on Mooney

    There is a most excel­lent online sem­inar on Mooney’s Repub­lican War on Sci­ence going on over at Crooked Tim­ber. The usual gang is review­ing it, with the addi­tion of the ines­tim­able Tim Lam­bert and Steve Fuller. Wait a minute…Steve Fuller?…

    Reply

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